Reality of Selling.
Ep 8- Charlie Day 'Reality of selling'
Give us some context about who you are. So talk about the reality of selling because Charlie's the best salesperson I know. She has a whole company that teaches people how to sell. And every time I'm like, I need to do more sales. Like I need to sell more every single time Charlie's responds. But I wanted to bring you on because selling is one of those topics where everyone's like, Oh, it's all right for that person, or oh, it's alright for that person. And I'd say people are like, we're friends. So I'm just gonna say, Oh, right. It's right for Charlie, because she's really bubbly to confidential talk to people. And selling is a lot about actually talking to people.
What would you say people say this? This perception of sales. I mean, there's all the like, achiness stuffing?
Yeah, and I get that all the time. Like, oh, it's easy peasy, Charlie, because you're confident.
Now I'm questioning myself anyway. So felling is an exchange of energy. It's you put in a product or a service out there and someone coming and saying yes, I want that thing. And I believe that you've got to show up as yourself especially as a small business owner but even in bigger businesses that's got to feed down from the person at the top to the person who's actually making that sale. So I think and I say this all the time really noisy like show up as your authentic self online.
What is an authentic self? Can someone just tell me like it's but anyway, people do say all the time, Oh, you're so confident you're so confident, but I actually think well, actually confidence sometimes looks like arrogance. And I could be a bit much for people I know you won't be able to believe that Inge, but I can be a bit much for some people. So actually, somebody use a bit quieter, a bit more of an introvert a bit more reserved, might listen and understand people's problems a bit more than someone who's really confident and really chatty, really bubbly. We've all been sold to buy that person who is just that, you know, you need to buy this, you need to buy this, you need to buy this you doesn't listen, selling should be about asking questions about listening and then only coming in to talk when you're ready to solve that person's problem and sell to them ultimately.
And in exchange of energy. What do you mean by that?
Well, people buy from people don't they? Yeah. So how are you showing it like if I had turned up to this podcast? Today I'm delighted and I can't really be bothered. It's a very different energy to like, Yeah, let's do this. I'm so up for talking to your people about sales. And if it's what I always get my clients to do, think about the best possible sales scenario you've been in. Tell me about a good sale scenario that you've been in, where you felt really great about buying the thing?
Oh, I'm quite hard to sell to, I think, like you. I purposely told someone this the other day, and they thought I was an absolute asshole. I won't buy anything and sometimes text me. I can't remember. Something nice. So I might not be a great example. Let me think, actually, the last time was probably buying this house. The sales guy was really nice. And unusual for an estate agent. I think because it was his part of the development. And they were quick to respond. I need things to happen quite quickly in my life. So I got in touch with them before the first bricks had been laid. And I was like, I want to house on that. It's that development. They got in touch with me the next day, they invited us to go and see a different house and a different plot. And then he was very flexible, I think, partly because he was new to the role. And he didn't understand where he could say no, and not say, you know, not offer us things. But yeah, that was probably apart from that business wise. I always wait for people even if I really want it, I wait for them to follow up with me. And if they don't, I won't buy it.
So yesterday, I got a new haircut. It's short, and I've been getting my hair blow dried twice a week at the same place. Okay. And yesterday, when the girl was blow drying my hair, she said, do you know about our blow dry passes? And I said no, I don't anything about your blow dry passes? What? What's that, and she was like, you can buy a pack. And you can come in as many times as you want for a month. And I was like, Oh my God, that sounds amazing. That's amazing. She was honestly Yeah, you should get one. I was like, Well, yeah, because I've been getting my hair blow dried twice a week. So yeah, I should get one. And then I sat there. And I purposefully waited. I waited, and I waited. And then when I was leaving, she said to me, that's 25 pounds. And I said 25 pounds. And she said yeah. And I said 25 pounds just for today just for the blow dryer today. And she said, yeah, 25 pounds for the blow dryer today. And I said oh, okay. All right. Thank you paid it and left the building. That's probably quite a unique example. Because I think the two of us are quite what's the word stubborn? Maybe with others?
It's interesting. You say that? That's a unique example. Because I don't think it is.
ery typical example. So I run the entrepreneurs growth Club, which is a Facebook group. And every Sunday, I go live. And I talk about, say that talk about this sort of stuff. What do you believe, making sales and I collect so many stories like this, so many stories. So I'm not another one for you. I was at my Birmingham book launch. And I wanted to buy a round of drinks for everybody. And I said, Oh, can I just order some drinks? And he said, you can either use a QR code or you can come downstairs and order. And I started using the QR code. And I literally had to make coffee with milk and sugar. And there were like, 20 people there. And I was like, This is gonna take me forever. So in the end, I went back downstairs, ordered it or 70 quid paid for it back upstairs. Now we were all chatting and networking. And then we sat down to do like the actual Chitty chatty talkie talkie bit. And the guy came up and said, Can I get you any more drinks? And at this point, we've probably been there like sort of 45 minutes. So everyone had finished the first round of drinks. I said, Oh, yeah, that will be amazing. If you could bring up another round of drinks. That'd be amazing. He said, Okay, you have to use the QR code, or come downstairs and order the drinks. And I said, Oh, well, we're about to get started. So I haven't got time to do that. So if that's the case, we just want to order any drinks. And he said, I tell you what, I could bring up some tap water for you. So he missed out on 70 pounds worth of drinks and a little independent cafe that he ran. Yeah, he was happy to bring up water free water that he had to go out of his way. Honestly, it happens to me all the time.
That's definitely what I mean is the uniqueness is the stubbornness of us to refuse to write. Other people would say, oh, Sell me the blow dry thing, please, to me.
Yeah, because I sit there and like, No, you need to learn as a business owner that you need to follow me up if you don't follow me up. But no, that's what I meant about, like the unique I don't think many people sit and think like, I think a lot of people will make the sales for someone else if they want to. Although I do think that there's some people who are either not savvy enough.
I mean, I guess the blow dry thing was probably a bit unique, because I would have been saving myself money, and I will buy it next time. But just wanted to teach them a lesson. And actually, it was not the salon owner, but the person under him who did it. So I wanted to see how it happened because I know the guy so I can feed back to him. And so I could say, I should come in and do some sales training for your whole team. So really upselling myself at all times. But I think you know, other people might like let's say, hairdressers is a perfect thing, because there's so much they can sell. So let's say the product that they use on you when their shampoo and conditioner your hair or whatever. Like, if they'd have mentioned Oh, you know, you should use this mask twice a week and it would repair your hair. A lot of people might not have the confidence to be like, Oh, I was really interested in that mask if they don't mention it again. Like, do you want to make your next appointment? I tell you what, why don't we get your next appointment now because we're really busy for next week, actually, or whatever it is. I think that it's not that important to people is it to buy the thing? What do you like?
So the masks for example. Well, the mask or put in your next appointment for us like let's say someone's inquired, that's the word I'm looking for that inquired about booking him for like a one to one with me. And so I'm like, brilliant in go one to one with me. That's gonna happen. That money's in the bag, getting out of blardy blar. I know why Inga wants it because she wants to make more sales. It's fairly urgent that she makes a sale. So I think that she will buy it. But in your life, you've got to like your kids and your housework and all of the things. And the top of my mind is, is endless money coming in? Yeah, I'm updating stripe like a madman. We've forgotten about it. Because yeah, in the grand scheme of things, it's not that important to buy the thing.
Yeah,, I know what you mean. Yeah, it's true. You do forget, like we might be stubbornly waiting for follow up. Other people just forget about the follow up. And then I guess then there's pocket people, like you said, Who and just not confident enough to ask for the follow up? People then sales become jolly.
Following up, yes. Oh, my gosh, so important. So it is on his birthday on the fourth of December. And I inquired about a cake. He wants this big sweetie cake that we've seen. And I inquired about it, and the woman sent me the price. And again, like, it's not that important to buy the cake, because I couldn't actually just go out into Tesco that morning and buy a cake. It's not up there on my list of priorities. But she followed up with me and said, Do you want to buy this cake or not? Because if not, somebody else wants this slot. And suddenly it goes to the top of your priority list. Yeah, I'll transfer the money now.
Yeah. It's so true. It's so true. But then when we apply that to our businesses, then if you think about like the reality, if I go back to the point, like the Instagram versus reality of selling, do you think people who make good salespeople are just people who keep on top of this?
Yeah, okay. Good. sales person for me is persistent. And just will not take no for an answer.
I guess people have to separate themselves from their ego as well.
100% Yeah. If you get in the way, like, see, I think people think my, my job is so glamorous, you know? Oh, Charlie's a sales expert. That must be so glamorous. It's like literally the least glamorous job ever. Like I just basically ask, ask people questions all day long and follow up with them until I can't follow up. The average person. How many times do we need to follow up the average person?
Oh, like three? Nine. I want to say like 23.
Where do you get out from? 12? Yeah. 12 Oh, my goodness.
So I should be messaging people. 12 times and Should I say, That's it? It's not happening. What about that whole voice in your head, though that goes, oh my god, I'm pestering someone, or like, I'm badgering this person, or they haven't answered me back. So it's clearly a No. What about that?
In my head? Let's take the cake example. For example. so she may have been sitting at home going, I really wanted I mean, she's in my community. So she probably knows I'm going to share the cake. I'm going to talk about her. It's a two way street. So she may have been at home thinking, I just so want Charlie to buy this cake. How can I make Charlie buy this cake? I know, I'll follow up. She's always a follow up. But she might have thought, if I follow up, is that going to seem too pushy? Is that going to seem too much? She sent me that message. And my first thought was, oh, my gosh, that is so kind of her to remind me because I have forgotten. I didn't think pushy bitch.
Oh, you're not a nasty person.
But like, do you know I mean, how many people live with you who you've already got a relationship with? Because I just want to make it super clear to the listeners right now. I do not believe in cold messaging. So following up from a cold message, you get that on Facebook, like literally 12 messages and you haven't responded to one of them? You don't know who the person is? That is not good. But I'm talking about someone you've already got the relationship with, you've already built a relationship with or they've inquired or they've worked with you in the past, or whatever it is, following up with them. You know, if I was to follow up with you and say, Inge, you're interested in some sales advice for your team? Are you still interested in that? And then you ignore me. And then I come back saying, hey, Inge haven't heard from you in a week? Are you still interested in sales advice or not? I feel like I need to hire a
whole person. Just set a follow up everyone, because I definitely know that I could make more money in my business, if I was actually properly following up. But I just personally don't have the time.
So I think that that's a really key point. The one thing that I would say is I think sales needs to come from the top. So I have someone helping me with the sales in my business, but I tell them exactly what to do. So as long as it is coming from you, then I think that's such a good hire.
They make their money back ideally. And the other thing I do, just in case, anybody's listening to this, and they're like, oh my god, I'd love to hire someone, but I'm not in a position to or whatever, what I do is start the day with five follow ups. And then it literally takes like five minutes, 10 minutes maximum, to follow up with five people and then you know that you've done it. And then in the same way, I just make sure I do one thing every day. That's like sales generating because often, especially when you get busy and your diaries really fall, you're back to back. Actually, what are you doing to create more sales?
Yes, I got cross myself, actually recently, because I realised that with the growth of all the businesses, I need to step back from being operational, just step into selling and generate like being the breaststroke Person of the company like stroking forwards and pushing. We're always doing breaststroke.
We're breast stroking right. Everyone listening breaststroke? Imagine that. But then, so how do you if you have a client who's just so in their head about selling, I guess that comes from all of the kind of cold selling that people get? And then they think I'm doing that? How do you? How do you kind of combat that for someone?
So the first thing that I would do is make sure that they are 100% selling something that they totally believe in? Yes. And they know what difference it's going to bring to the person. Yeah. And then like, so I've got a follow up spreadsheet, which a lot of my clients get, it really separates me out from the follow up. So rather than it been like, this is Inge Hunter, my friend, my co worker, like somebody that I know, is just like that somebody who I need to follow up with today. Like I know that that might sound a little bit cold in context.
But if you get all in your head about well, actually this person is this person, so I can't follow up with them. Well, actually my follow up spreadsheet 24 hours after they've inquired goes red, you need to follow up with her again, 24 hours after that goes red you need to follow up with her again. So in the morning, I'll just look at the spreadsheet and go right to that one's red. That one's red. That one's red message out. And what if she says no, what will that mean? I don't even get caught up in any of that. It's just a process. And if you read my book, if anyone hasn't read my book, she holds up the book.
Not visual but you can kind of have a hazy colour with a picture of me says in front sales is easy, a practical Guide to Creating more sales and your business doing sales the right way. If you read this book, there's a whole chapter on follow up. And I actually give examples of the exact message. Yes in my book, Sales Is Easy, It's only £10.99 on Amazon.
Can we get a spreadsheet?
That is a question. You need to come and work with me if you want the spreadsheet? All right. It is going to be for sale in the new year, though, depending on when this goes out. This episode is very much reality now.
What do you want to change about your industry? Because how long have you been in sales? Because your partner is also in sales?
Well, I set up my own business when I was 21. So since then, really, that is 13 years?
I've got a good question. So if your partner is in sales like a corporation, I'm getting you to ever argue about sales strategies, because he comes from a corporation and you come from the small business world?
Yes. You might be a bit strong, but definitely have our own opinions. So going back to the first question of what do I want to say, I want to change in my industry, the fact that just because it ties in nicely, I won't stop doing this, until I feel like female business owners are stepping up and selling in the same way that I see other people because I think that all of this stuff that I'm saying that is alien to small business owners, sometimes what I say to my husband is you need to soften it a little bit. You need to sit back on it rather than just be like, here's the thing. Do you know, I mean? I feel like my skills are very much around questioning and creating that conversation and really getting to the root cause of why people aren't buying from me, their biggest problems are all of those sorts of things. And sometimes I think if you go in with the intention of not selling, but just understanding, you actually get to the sale a lot quicker. Whereas my husband doesn't. He sells search technology.
Do you think it depends on the type of product you're selling?
Yeah, I do. And I do think that the online space is different. He lives in a world where you discount things all the time. So you're constantly in this negotiation if they know that you can discount it. They're trying to figure out how much you can discount it. I don't discount anything. I never have. I remember people back in the day when I ran my party business, saying, if we booked two hours, would you do it for slightly cheaper? And I was just always like, no I won't. I've never discounted a thing in my life. Because I think it gets really messy. If I'm like it's £1000 pounds to work with me. But then suddenly on Black Friday, it's £500 pounds to work with me. It makes me think well hang on a minute. How much is this worth? £500? Are you worth £1000?
Yeah, I know what you mean. It's a different kind of buying wellness not buying power, is it but it's different kind of leverages, under different sizes of companies.
Very true, thank you.